Ring's top 10 British HW's, all time - your thoughts?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by McGrain, Aug 7, 2012.

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  1. Legend X

    Legend X Boxing Addict banned Full Member

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    Henry Cooper beat Zora Folley, the #1 contender.
    Tommy Farr beat Max Baer.

    Danny Williams beat a decrepit Mike Tyson. As did Kevin McBride.



    20 months earlier.

    Fair enough.
    Baer hadn't beat a contender for a while. But I think Baer was better Valuev.
    And, no, he wasn't losing to anyone by then.


    No, Baer was a young man who went on to be #1 contender again.



    It's not rose-tinted crap.
    I don't think Bugner was much good.

    But Haye has beat maybe 2 HWs who deserved top 10 rankings, and they weren't "top contenders" necessarily.
    If you want to include the likes of Ruiz or Barrett as legit contenders, then Bugner beat plenty of fringe guys like that.
     
    Legend X, Aug 8, 2012
    #136
  2. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    It was a complete tear of the Achiles tendon. I think the hep could definitely have been a serious problem - i'm not sure - but I think the injury is understated in its affects.
     
    McGrain, Aug 8, 2012
    #137
  3. Flea Man

    Flea Man มวยสากล Full Member

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    I think he can beat Vitali as well.
     
    Flea Man, Aug 8, 2012
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  4. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    It was a non-effort and he didn't appear to be anywhere near Wlad in class. Haye is CLEARLY better than the HW's he has beaten, for the most part, but CLEARLY not in Wlad's class.

    Hence the confusion. He hasn't met anyone in his own class where we can get a decent read. I'd welcome a match with someone like Adamek or Povetkin.

    I'd dispute that relative comparison, but agree he didn't dominate. You could argue he was lucky given the location. But I kind of give him a pass - Valuev is hard to peg. He's absolutely huge though, and sets a certain kind of problem, one that Haye was able to solve. I don't think it really tells us much though.


    And obviously if he became the second best HW after Wlad, that would change things a bit as far as this argument goes.
     
    McGrain, Aug 8, 2012
    #139
  5. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    I don't know how to reply to that first paragraph.

    Then we judge h2h differently. No biggy.
     
    lufcrazy, Aug 8, 2012
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  6. Legend X

    Legend X Boxing Addict banned Full Member

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    I think Povetkin is possibly way removed from the fighter he was 4 or 5 years ago. Povetkin v Haye would have meant something back in 2009.





    Sadly, I think the HW division has become "Wlad .... and then the rest".
    Wlad is #1.
    I'm quite happy to rank Haye at #2 right now. And my argument doesn't change for it.
     
    Legend X, Aug 8, 2012
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  7. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    I think it would mean something now. It's a clear step up from Chisora and co. IMO (though i admit i'd like to se Povetkin-Chisora). He has definitely faded. I thought Huck beat him.






    I don't really think that is sad - I'm enjoying his alleged domination.
    But presumably beating Vitali would enhance his resume considerably in your eyes? That is my point.
     
    McGrain, Aug 8, 2012
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  8. Legend X

    Legend X Boxing Addict banned Full Member

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    Well, if Huck beat him, I'd say he's fast becoming irrelevant.
    Anyway Haye aint gonna fight him, so it's academic.







    Yeah. It could be worse.

    It would enhance his resume.
    But fighting Wlad again soon, and losing in a more competitive fashion, would make me rate him as a better fighter.
     
    Legend X, Aug 8, 2012
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  9. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Well i'd say two three things about this - first, Huck is really, really underated now. Second, Povetkin did win - my card shows a Povetkin loss but not an obvious, embarrassing one. The judges had Povetkin. Third, everyone's entitled to one of these. But we agree, basically, that he has faded. Unfortuantely we learn nothing from his next one.



    Wlad totalled him, in his own way. No need for these two to fight again unless Haye takes out Vitali. Haye beating Vitali then Wlad knocking out Haye would be a wonderful thing for boxing.
     
    McGrain, Aug 8, 2012
    #144
  10. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    He's made too much money for his own good.

    As fans we'd love nothing more than to see him face vitali, povetkin, chambers, adamek and arreola before giving it another go against wlad.

    The reality is he can probably afford to sit out for another year, outclass vitali then lose again to wlad.

    It's a shame really because I think he'd comfortably beat those I listed aside from wlad obviously.
     
    lufcrazy, Aug 8, 2012
    #145
  11. Legend X

    Legend X Boxing Addict banned Full Member

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    Yes, that could happen.
    Wlad's probably got a couple of years left in him.
     
    Legend X, Aug 8, 2012
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  12. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    McG, how do you pre real chag matching up h2h with past heavyweights? Probably unfair matching him with elites but what about the next level like sharkey, witherspoon etc?
     
    lufcrazy, Aug 8, 2012
    #147
  13. SuzieQ49

    SuzieQ49 The Manager Full Member

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    Mcgrain, you lost me on Adamek. Or should I say Averagmek. He wouldn't last 3 rounds in with haye
     
    SuzieQ49, Aug 8, 2012
    #148
  14. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    I doubt he would let anyone down, but he doesn't have the physical gifts to do consistently well against that level of fighter I don't think. Mind you, those guys had their own problems.
     
    McGrain, Aug 8, 2012
    #149
  15. Legend X

    Legend X Boxing Addict banned Full Member

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    What are Chagaev's best fights ?
     
    Legend X, Aug 8, 2012
    #150
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