I agree. I have it a bit easier, since I've been doing some karate recently and the back foot off the ground is a bit easier to handle. True. Tunney would have been a troublesome lightheavyweight opponent as well, even though he lacked extensive combination punching like Ali. Right. I admit, the idea of "reverse engineering" Fitzsimmons is rather intriguing. I might do it to myself sometime if I have the time and energy. Primarily, though, this thread is designed to demonstrate how much we can learn about Fitz when we really do some heavy analysis. It's also an interesting test case for looking at a style of boxing that's very, very different from modern stuff. Broadens our horizons and all that.
Ive never done Karate but a boy at my gym has so i'll maybe try to rope him in to help me out. Again you could add Loughran. I think Fitz style is at its best against a 1 shot bralwer whos aggresive. His defensive manuevers look to avoid just one shot at a time so combos would be bad for him. But i beleive combos where used often then. Is there any fighter you think has any similarities to Fitz that we could maybe watch aswell to get a better understanding of the style? its good interesting stuff anyway.
:think Well, Corbett fights rather differently from Fitz, but since he came around in the same time period he has a lot of overlaps. You can see him in the 22 minute Corbett/Fitz fight I already posted, and also in the sparring with Tunney (http://orphanfilmsymposium.blogspot.com/2008_05_01_archive.html) and the sparring with Courtney, where he does something rather similar to Fitzsimmons' "stick out your hand as he lunges for you and allow him to run into it while you draw your body back" technique on p. 122 of his manual, plus some idea of how he threw the hook (or left-hand swing as he called it): [YT]k7ZXB7Gjw1E[/YT] At one point, Corbett leans back and then throws a right hand a bit like Fitz would. Then there's this manual from Fitzsimmons' time period: http://www.lulu.com/content/paperback-book/boxing-and-how-to-train/3349945
About a 12 second clip. Jeffries lands a sinking straight right to the stomach, and a crashing hook to the jaw. This is not to be confused with the re-enactment of the Ko by actors.
It might turn out to be an unorthodox style requiring certain natural reflexes that would not have been possible for most fighters in Fitzsimmons own era. They say that 99% of fighters would have got knocked out trying to emulate Muhamad Ali and I am sure that the same is true for Jimmy Wilde or Jimmy Slatterey. Some fighters are able to impliment styles that would not normaly be possible due to reflexes and more importantly ability to judge distances. The one thing that does seem to come across about Fitz from newspaper acounts is that he would rather make you miss by an inch than by a mile.
That is always a possibility as well. Then again, Fitz did block more than Ali did, and the leaning back actually assists in blocking and countering.
well lads the rest of my afternoon is free so ill read through and watch all this stuff in afew minutes. Then practis some of the techniques today and tonight in the gym
Ah, I see. On the other hand, Corbett seems to be a lot closer to orthodox (in line with 1890's boxing manuals) than Fitz. I think he also wrote a boxing manual, although he didn't pose for it. Shame, that. I'll see if I can find it for you. It also occurs to me, with regards to Fitzsimmons, that the advanced age at which he finally stepped down from top-flight opposition would indicate that his style didn't rely on blazing fast reflexes.
Here's Corbett's manual: http://www.lulu.com/content/paperba...ts-on-training-and-the-official-rules/2165637 You could also check out, for comparison's sake, R.G. Allanson-Winn's book on boxing (full view) at Google Books.
I think that both Fitzsimmons and Corbett were unorthodox by the standards of the era. I think they both relied heavily on being able to anticipate an opponents moves and avoid blows by minor adjustments. Something that is not likley to be covered in a manual or taught to a novice. I agree that Fitzsimmons style was the more economical and that is probably the main reason why he prevailed on the single ocasion they fought. One fighter that I see similarities to in both of them is Jimmy Wilde.
CT what exact pages of the manuel do you recommend for reading and the pictures start at 115 dont they? Im downloading the Corbett footage just now so ill wathc it either later tonight or tiomorrow and go over the stuff
I see what you mean; Fitz's manual is very long and has a lot of asides and irrelevant stuff (for our purposes, anyway) On the second page of the thread, I copied and pasted all of the text that deals with how to move and fight. The pictures themselves start on p. 115, and I tried to copy and paste them into my posts as well (though apparently they're not showing up for other people). I could go back and check the page numbers for the text, but I'd recommend you just copy and paste my posts and print that out for the text. The pictures you'll probably have to go to the manual for. Also (if you can't see it in my posts), there are pictures of the stance on pages 68-71 and punching the bag on pages 80-81 (at least, those are the pages on Google Books). Sorry if this isn't specific enough; if you need any more help, just tell me and I'll narrow it down further for you. :good
Yeh i saw your copy and pasted bit. Ill copy that onto word and print it off. The pictures didnt show up for me but i will look at the pages you say they are and t5ry to print them off also. Might not get to the gym tommorow but ill try get over the weekend as i dont have a key ill have to ask somebody who has one to let me in. As im going to film it in the gym where all my equipment is.