Top 10 HWs after talent/potential?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Bokaj, Nov 22, 2009.


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  1. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Bowe doesn't fit with the criteria I use. He got all the breaks, had a very well managed career and a great trainer; but he was missing that one key attribute for greatness: discipline. As I said, that's part of the package for me.
     
    Bokaj, Nov 22, 2009
    Bokaj, Nov 22, 2009
    #16
  2. bodhi

    bodhi Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I like it when I look at your criteria. Especially Walcott at number 2. Personally, I´d pick Jeffries, Dempsey and Patterson over Lewis and Frazier and possibly over Marciano.
     
    bodhi, Nov 23, 2009
    bodhi, Nov 23, 2009
    #17
  3. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Yeah, this one is very hard and needs some revising. Dempsey may very well deserve a higher spot as does Foreman. Considering how late he got into boxing, I think Foreman did extraordinarily well. If he had started when 5-6 years younger, who knows what he would have done?
     
    Bokaj, Nov 23, 2009
    Bokaj, Nov 23, 2009
    #18
  4. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Liston's only real weakness was an inability to cut off the ring ,imo.
    He had a tendency to just follow you around,unlike his sometime protege Foreman ,who was geometrically excellent in this department.
     
    mcvey, Nov 23, 2009
    mcvey, Nov 23, 2009
    #19
  5. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Good point.
     
    Bokaj, Nov 23, 2009
    Bokaj, Nov 23, 2009
    #20
  6. Unforgiven

    Unforgiven VIP Member banned Full Member

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    I thought Foreman was not great at cutting off the ring, esp. eg. against Jimmy Young, and against Tommy Morrison (and almost everyone else in his comeback), and even against Peralta. Most of his opponents were handpicked come-forward or stuck-in-concrete types though, so he never really needed to be great at cutting off the ring.
     
    Unforgiven, Nov 23, 2009
    Unforgiven, Nov 23, 2009
    #21
  7. Manassa

    Manassa - banned

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    I thought you said 'whether fulfilled or not.' Bowe was given the right opportunities, but he could have made himself better.
     
    Manassa, Nov 23, 2009
    Manassa, Nov 23, 2009
    #22
  8. junior-soprano

    junior-soprano Active Member Full Member

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    how about maxie baer ?? here's a character who didn't live up to his potential.
     
    junior-soprano, Nov 23, 2009
    junior-soprano, Nov 23, 2009
    #23
  9. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Bowe should certainly be on a list like this.
     
    McGrain, Nov 23, 2009
    McGrain, Nov 23, 2009
    #24
  10. PetethePrince

    PetethePrince Slick & Redheaded Full Member

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    Foreman mentally broke after Zaire. To me, Foreman's downfall is much greater than Tyson's one because it translated more in results and physically.

    Ali was surprised at how great he was at cutting off the ring. Alas, the rope a dope came into existence.

    Foreman was great at cutting the ring off.
     
    PetethePrince, Nov 23, 2009
    PetethePrince, Nov 23, 2009
    #25
  11. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Yes, but he fell short because of intrinsic factors, personal defiencies, not because external ones. And this is about the external ones.

    For me it doesn't mean much to say "if he only he was a bit more discplined, stable, mentally stronger etc". It's like saying "if only he was stronger, faster, bigger, smarter...". The intangibles are just as big a part of what you bring to the table as the rest of it.

    I find it much more interesting to think "if he only he got the breaks others got". And that's what I'm doing here. If all these fighters had started at a young age, had been as well trained and well managed as possible and had been given the opportunities, what would they have achieved? It's by answering that question that I do the ranking.
     
    Bokaj, Nov 23, 2009
    Bokaj, Nov 23, 2009
    #26
  12. Dempsey1238

    Dempsey1238 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Not true, the rope a dope was there LONG before Ali was fighting, Jake Lamotta, and Archie Moore was known for "Fighting off the ropes" as it was called before Ali renamed it.

    Also Ali had that plan down BEFORE the fight even started, as in training, he was having his sparing partners beat on Ali, as Ali was just lying on the ropes and taking it.

    He plan it. Train the plan and excuted the plan, non of this bs that the plan came, because Ali could not out box Foreman.
     
    Dempsey1238, Nov 23, 2009
    Dempsey1238, Nov 23, 2009
    #27
  13. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    He started training that way as early as before the first Liston fight.
     
    Bokaj, Nov 23, 2009
    Bokaj, Nov 23, 2009
    #28
  14. ThinBlack

    ThinBlack Boxing Addict banned

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    Greg Page had all the tools, only possible thing not really having the strength and desire.
     
    ThinBlack, Dec 15, 2011
    ThinBlack, Dec 15, 2011
    #29
  15. Seamus

    Seamus Proud Kulak Full Member

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    I don't believe in unrealized potential. We all realize the actual potential we possess. It is a self-evident truth.
     
    Seamus, Dec 15, 2011
    Seamus, Dec 15, 2011
    #30
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