Tyson and Ali showing the difference between punching power and punching ability

ps. I haven't read the context of thread by the way, too long for work and with big pics on it. It's obviously good if it's Chris P, but if I'm missing the point anywhere then apologies.

I'll read it in morning. :good

 

Was a good read.

A point to make though on styles as fist of fury already mentioned. One is a more cautious counter punch and outside boxer, one is an aggressive brawler. A guy with good ring generalmanship - by which I don't specifically mean as being a clever fighter but more a crude and spoiling runner.

A guy who is perhaps only fringe world-class could potentially survive Tyson if they had a decent/good chin and constantly run around the ring aswell as spoiled, tying him up on the inside just looking to survive. Not saying this would happen all the time but in cases.

However, Ali was a more defensively minded fighter in the sense that he's not the aggressor. I know I don't need to educate people on Ali as I'm sure you all know his style and probably all know more about him than me, but being a more defensively minded counter-puncher obviously you are forcing your opponent to be the aggressor and obviously therefore they are leaving themselves more open and in a more vulnerable position to take shots.

Ali's connect percentage would or at least should of been a lot higher than Tyson's, and I would be willing to bet that looking at their respective KO wins, Ali's opponents would on average have taken a lot more punches leading to the knock out than Tyson's.

While I don't think there's any doubt Tyson had more punching power - and I'm sure your not disputing this but interest just bringing up some points - I do feel Ali's power is under-rated. It wasn't fantastic by any means, but he's not exactly feather-fisted. His ability to throw 'punches in bunches' and land them in combinations was superb and probably attributed to most of his knock outs, rather than one-punch knock outs or two punches even.

While Tyson could put together blistering combinations, he would probably find it harder to land them because of the mentality of his opponents and his style, his opponents would not be as exposed defensively or in as vulnerable positions as Ali's. However of course he had great one-punch knock out power to make up for it.

 

Good post CP. Very Good observations.

I think some people here are confusing the points CP is trying to make. Nobody is saying (or should be saying) that Ali was a better hitter than Tyson. Quite simply, he wasn't. Tyson hit harder, much harder.

However, there is more than one way to skin a cat and I feel that Ali had the art. Tyson, basically, knew only one way. If that worked, fine. Otherwise, he was at a loss what to do.

 

I understand the point I just don't think the lists are similar enough to draw a conclusion.

 

Yeah, read the bloody thread!!!

And look at the pictures!



But yes, Chris has come up with another great read. Ali's greatness more than power got him ko's that bigger hitters sometimes didn't find for sure. Holmes is another good example, he's stopped a lot of guys that had never been stopped before.

 

It would make for interesting reading regardless.

No cliche. That fight stank to the rafters. You don't need evidence to connect the dots in this case.

 

edit.

 

Good stuff and great points, Chris.

 

Thanks.

I agree that Ali did not have big puncher power at all. Which is what made the observation more interesting.


p.s. i added those big pics to make it MORE readable. atsch

:good

 

Ali was the better finisher of the 2. He was an all time great at it & when a guy was busted up or badly wobbled by Ali, the fight didn't go on much longer. Tyson could hurt guys but sometimes they'd go the distance or something, but he didn't always finish opponents immediately > they got hurt.

 

Part of that could be due to if Ali had an opponent badly hurt, chances are they were taking a sustained beating and absorbing big shots for quite a while and had nothing left. Ali wasn't a big puncher, so if he hurt an opponent it was usually later in the fight when they had been getting tagged often and were considerably slowed down.

Tysons finishing abilities are second to none, the only one that I think may equal him is Louis.

 

Interesting read - I also think that aswell as Ali`s power being underrated, his finishing ability is also underrated & rarely mentioned when discussing his best points.

 

This content is protected

 

I've got that interview somewhere. Remember it well. Cobb was such a brilliant interview, every time. What you see is what you get, and then some. One of the most durable fighters in history, for a period of years.

 

How are Tyson's finishing skills second to none? He's just good, but not in the same category as the great finishers like other heavies Foreman/Ali//Louis/etc. He's not as good of finisher as a Lewis or Holmes either, come to think of it.

Tyson couldn't get Ruddock out of there and the guy had a broken jaw & that's a zero defense opponent w/ mediocre stamina and wide open for counters. Tyson didn't finish 42-1 underdog Douglas > having him on the deck & Douglas was ko'd by other fighters before and after that fight. He had Williams badly hurt early and couldn't finish the show. McBride was all busted up and the ref that wasn't giving Tyson warnings for illegal activities would've stopped that bout if those cuts get just a little worse. Those guys all managed to slip thru the cracks and finishers don't let guys slip thru the cracks.

When a guy was busted up against Ali it was all over. And as soon as he got a guy ready to go, they went. Once fighters reach the top 10, it's finishing skills that count > punching power anyway because the elite competition have some survival skills & have tools.