just got some new dvd subject and was surprised to see shavers ko the **** out of norton that fast kenny didnt even fight back, very surprised at a 19-0 ron lye verses quarry ronny didnt even fight and quarry was on his game that night but the biggest pleaser was watching rex layne knock the bejesus out of bob satterfield. what a punch satterfield was laid out.giardello - grahm was good as was saxton vs gil turner and of course the basillio- saxton fights, lamotta put on a show in his second fight with bob murphy then tex cobb(who seemed to be a big joke) beat ernie shavers up . ill fill ya in when i finish my new set of dvds.
Earnie had been gunning for a Norton match for a lot of years. It sure didn't help the Norton chances any to fight the guy that late in his career. He would've needed absolute top conditioning and reflexes and legs to deal with a Shavers from say 75 onwards. And he still likely gets brutally ko'd at some point. I think Coetzee and Knoetze get Kenny out of there as well in that 78/79 timeframe.
Wouldn't be surprised by any big puncher ruining Norton to be honest - and they don't come much bigger punching than Shavers - ps that looping uppercut was just brutalising!!
Part of the reason Kenny had so much trouble with fast starting sluggers was his propensity for letting them get off first, to see what they had. John Tate was much better in handling Mercado, Knoetze and Coetzee, all of whom would have likely demolished Norton in quick order. Tate could and did get laid out by Berbick and Weaver in longer bouts, but he didn't have the mental frailty of Norton. Tate proved it didn't take a great chin to beat the sluggers he did if one has his head together. (Tate-Cooney was proposed as Gerry's comeback fight after Holmes. Larry was asked if that was a good idea for Cooney. Holmes replied, "I think it's a bad idea for John Tate! There's something wrong with him, to get knocked out twice like that, and we all know how Cooney can hit." But given how Mercado, Knoetze and Coetzee turned out, maybe it would have revived Tate's career as well.)
No, that would not have helped Tate 1 iota. No punchers ever again. That Weaver fight really blew out the candles. He'd already had very very bad ko defeats to Stevenson and I forget the name of that other guy in that amatuer fight--oh yeah, Chapman. Tate was out for minutes in both, plus the Weaver result. Too much to overcome. I thought it was criminal for Miller to take him back out after just 3 months against Berbick. In Canada. Those heavies that lose badly need softies for opponents and it helps to be in their backyard where they are the house fighter. And Tate went out real bad against Berbick too. He had some other ESPN type bouts in that 83 timeframe but there wasn't much left. The funny thing with Norton was how bad he looked in those Middleton and Zanon fights. He really did not look too good early against Stephens either, come to think of it. And those were not the big hitters. Lyle/Earnie/Mercado/Coetzee/Knoetze all take Kenny out. Once Kenny's legs slowed down, it really reduced his effectiveness in there since his wheels are not what won him fights & just cannot afford that kind of deterioration. Remember how many people actually picked Norton to win that Cooney fight? Incredible. It just shows how so many folks pay attention to names and think these guys can be a Ponce DeLeon and magically find the fountain of youth with the flick of a switch. All that was necessary was to watch the Cobb and Ledoux fights and then insert Cooney instead. Recent form for years had not been good and now he's facing a big hitter that's 15 years younger.
IMHO you're bringing up Norton efforts when he was shot... Different fighters hit the wall at different times for different reasons. I question the "if Norton fights a banger, he's out like a lite reasoning" Many say Lyle would have iced him! We all love the Foreman/Lyle scrap but a pre-Ali Foreman would have put Lyle to sleep inside of 2.... For all his attributes, Lyle couldn't box a lick. Granted he was young and untested at the time but Quarry schooled him. And, as much as I love Jerry, that punch of his was overrated. He had to wear down contenders. His biggest KO's? Shavers? IMO an anamoly. Two months after that journeyman Joe Alexander clocked and dropped him with as good a left hook as you'll ever see. Lyle was green at the time of their fight. Mac Foster had feasted on nobodies and long in the tooth vets... Spencer was overrated. Name me another contender Jerry KO'd or stopped (I love Jerry) Jerry/Kenny's fight? Yes, Jerry was long gone at the time but something tells me Norton may have always been able to beat him, I don't think Quarry had the punch to KO a prime Kenny. Just trying to be objective... OK, trash me guys...
pre ali foreman showed more focus, was slightly lighter but just as raw. foreman still had such belief in his punch that he learnt nothing from the ali fight. He WAS LOOKING TO TAKE lyle out with each punch just as he always was before Ali. he knocked out rated guys like machen, London, bodell, neuman, zannon?