Was Charley Burley ever ranked number 1...

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Nemesis, Jul 11, 2011.


Page 5 of 6
  1. Nemesis

    Nemesis Well-Known Member Full Member

    1,650
    13
    Dec 9, 2005
    Fair do's, he was very nuetral (apart from constantly referring to Burley as 'Our Hero' :D).

    As you say it was interesting to see him pick up on the negative press Burley was getting.

    I found the ghost-written Robinson (by the hit and miss Dave Anderson) Auto very good, as it was incredibly in depth. I didnt think it was too biased, just a good read.

    I've stayed away from Hands Of Stone thus far, trying to get hold of the Conteh one on Amazon for my next read up.
     
    Nemesis, Jul 13, 2011
    Nemesis, Jul 13, 2011
    #61
  2. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

    42,723
    269
    Jul 22, 2004
    Thanks Nemesis, that's pretty low, what was his career high when being the maingate? :good
     
    PowerPuncher, Jul 13, 2011
    PowerPuncher, Jul 13, 2011
    #62
  3. Nemesis

    Nemesis Well-Known Member Full Member

    1,650
    13
    Dec 9, 2005
    An interesting note from Rosenfeld's book refers to a Daily News reporter by the name of Joe Rein, is this any relation to our very own John Garfield? Or is JG using a psuedonym?
     
    Nemesis, Jul 13, 2011
    Nemesis, Jul 13, 2011
    #63
  4. Nemesis

    Nemesis Well-Known Member Full Member

    1,650
    13
    Dec 9, 2005
    Probably the Carter bout, which shows the contrast between Robinson's marketability and Burley's lack thereof, when at the time Robinson was getting $100,000 gates before he picked up the WW title.
     
    Nemesis, Jul 13, 2011
    Nemesis, Jul 13, 2011
    #64
  5. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

    112,990
    48,067
    Mar 21, 2007
    Nice. I wish i'd done that.
     
    McGrain, Jul 13, 2011
    McGrain, Jul 13, 2011
    #65
  6. sweet_scientist

    sweet_scientist Boxing Junkie Full Member

    13,744
    88
    Nov 8, 2004
    Fair enough. Now about Burley being faster?

    Burley was naturally bigger - talking volume, not height. If Gavilan was his weight he'd comfortably fight the guys Burley did.



    It's relevant if we're discussing greatness I suppose.... About them being level in that regard, well, for Kid's prime, only a couple of guys held their own or ARGUABLY got the better of him - Ray Robinson and Bobo Olson. He fought the latter with one hand for much of the fight too.. Many held their own or got the better of Burley: Williams, Charles, Bivins, Marshall, Lytell, Abrams.

    Haven't seen any of Burley at welter, but if he wants to beat Gavilan there, he had better be a tremendous fighter - Seeing him on film doesn't give me any confidence to think he beats Gavilan - whatsoever.... (Not the best thing to go off granted).
     
    sweet_scientist, Jul 14, 2011
    sweet_scientist, Jul 14, 2011
    #66
  7. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

    112,990
    48,067
    Mar 21, 2007
    Handspeed on film favours Burley.

    Maybe - hard to be sure that a slightly bigger, to use your words, KG would beat a 215lb fighter. I think that's a leap of faith. This is not a p4p argument though.



    There might be something to this, but there is another way to look at it. I am quite happy that Williams and Moore were better than anyone KG beat, and that Zivic was likely as good. I think Burley has the more high class wins and has the bigger men. Taking into account KG's dominance, I'd see them close in terms of greatness. I wouldn't object to either one being a nose in front of the other.

    Personally, I think Burley looks extraordinary on film, as extraordinary as KG. I agree, though, that using footage of him playing with a huge-puncher 175lb contender is no kind of foil for predicting how a fight with KG would go.
     
    McGrain, Jul 14, 2011
    McGrain, Jul 14, 2011
    #67
  8. Unforgiven

    Unforgiven VIP Member banned Full Member

    58,748
    21,578
    Nov 24, 2005
    On an all-time list, do you guys rate Burley as a welter or as a middle ?
     
    Unforgiven, Jul 14, 2011
    Unforgiven, Jul 14, 2011
    #68
  9. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

    112,990
    48,067
    Mar 21, 2007
    Well I have no problem with ranking a fighter on multiple lists, but if you were ranking him on one list only it would have to be MW.

    Burley made the ESB top 10 for middle but not welter.
     
    McGrain, Jul 14, 2011
    McGrain, Jul 14, 2011
    #69
  10. Nemesis

    Nemesis Well-Known Member Full Member

    1,650
    13
    Dec 9, 2005
    I wasnt cherry pickin', mate.

    I couldnt find the book I was looking for last night (in relation to Robinson's purses), I'll have another look tonight.
     
    Nemesis, Jul 14, 2011
    Nemesis, Jul 14, 2011
    #70
  11. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

    112,990
    48,067
    Mar 21, 2007
    No, I know, Burley made pitiful money. It was a shame.

    If asked, of the top of my head, I would have guessed that Zivic was a bigger draw though.
     
    McGrain, Jul 14, 2011
    McGrain, Jul 14, 2011
    #71
  12. Unforgiven

    Unforgiven VIP Member banned Full Member

    58,748
    21,578
    Nov 24, 2005
    Yeah, ranking in both divisions makes sense to me.
     
    Unforgiven, Jul 14, 2011
    Unforgiven, Jul 14, 2011
    #72
  13. My dinner with Conteh

    My dinner with Conteh Tending Bepi Ros' grave again Full Member

    12,059
    3,562
    Dec 18, 2004

    Off the top of my head, he earned £28,000 for Turpin and over $100,000 for Bobo Olson (one of the bouts)
     
    My dinner with Conteh, Jul 14, 2011
    My dinner with Conteh, Jul 14, 2011
    #73
  14. My dinner with Conteh

    My dinner with Conteh Tending Bepi Ros' grave again Full Member

    12,059
    3,562
    Dec 18, 2004
    For what that's worth, i.e not even a carrot. :yep


    In terms of fight offers, the most notable Burley 'rumour' (besides Robinson) was for a match with Billy Conn.
     
    My dinner with Conteh, Jul 14, 2011
    My dinner with Conteh, Jul 14, 2011
    #74
  15. sweet_scientist

    sweet_scientist Boxing Junkie Full Member

    13,744
    88
    Nov 8, 2004
    Gavilan would vary his speed to catch fighters unawares, but he is clearly faster than Burley for mine when he chooses to 'unleash'.

    It is a leap, but if he's a bum, I'd back Kid in.

    Overall Burley probably has the better wins, but arguably beating Ray Robnson imo is more impressive than anything Burley has ever done...



    He looks really good, but to me he doesn't look as impressive as Kid Gavilan.
     
    sweet_scientist, Jul 14, 2011
    sweet_scientist, Jul 14, 2011
    #75
Page 5 of 6