except the defense part :good without the reflexes he has no substantial defense when pressured...a la Glen Johnson's attack. Roy had TALENT and REFLEXES, not a technically sound defense.
explain? I know that usually people see skills as something that can be trained... but punching power is definately something that can be trained! though some people naturally have more than others, the same can be said about hand speed. Punch resistance (which is what i meant when I said chin) can also be trained, though some people naturally have more than others.
Jones had head movement and great footwork. Would you not agree that those are part of defense? Having great athletic ability will not tell you This content is protected
Here's an example but there are many. Calzaghe, to the distracted observer, often looks like he's out there scrambling eggs, like he's wild or something and wins because he overwhelms his opponents with his superior workrate. True enough but the story doesn't end there. When you pay attention to what he does, you realize that Calzaghe does many subtle things that make perfect sense and that most boxers don't do, specifically when fighting inside. If, as many people say, his fundamentals are not exactly textbook, that's maybe because the textbook's missing a chapter or two. Mayweather's display of skills is very different, more like the boxing application of the pareto law or the 80/20 principle (20% of the work generates 80% of the result). Pretty much everything he does in a ring is meant to produce optimal result. Though he looks somewhat flatfooted and stationary at times, his weight's always shifting from one foot to the other, depending on what's going on. Therefore, he's always able to quickly respond, either move out or jump in, often with a left hook or a right hand lead to the head.
I think he had a pretty decent defense that was accentuated by his amazing athleticism. As opposed to guys like Toney, Hopkins, and Wright, who had great air-tight defenses and relied less on their athleticism. I believe thats why they were able to carry on their success in their later years, because even if they were not as quick or fleet-footed as their once were, they still have great defensive skills which allows them to avoid a lot of punishment and lenghten their careers. As opposed to someone like Roy Jones, who relied heavily on his athleticism, when his speed and reflexes start to erode, he started to get caught and ko'd. I believe you have had seen the same thing with Hamed had he continued his career into his 30's.
Fair enough, I disagree in that I feel Jones only augmented his defensive skills while knowing the textbook style, and has refused to change. But this is not a substantial or even provable point.
I didn't mean that you cannot learn how to take punches or you cannot learn how to hit harder. My opinion is that anybody and I mean anybody can be floored. You can have a great chin and get Koed by a featherfisted boxer. Placement of punches is very important too. I give more importance to the others skills you listed because those are very difficult to learn, and those can save my ass and yours if we know how to fight a boxer by using a good foot work, a good jab, counterpunching etc etc etc. If I have a decent punch and I learn how to punch better, then I might hit harder but even then I might end up losing even against Mayorga if I don't know how to fight that type of syles because I don't have the other sills you mentioned.
Well in that case Pernell Whittaker had a flawed defense as he relyed on being able to stand infront of people and make them miss because he could react to there punches. I think that when Pernell lost his reflex's he went down hill.
ok so if i understood your post, you consider punching power and punch resistance as skills but just not as important as the other ones.
There is a basic way to throw a punch, so the basics apply to everybody. It is in the textbooks where you will find the basics outlined. Advanced boxing skills are another matter. Mohammad Ali was highly skilled but would often violate the principles of boxing. His ability to move, and move quickly, allowed him to get away with these intrinsic flaws. Over the years I have often seen men imitate his style, but very few did it with success.
Yes, that's what I meant. Learning how to take a punch is very important and during training boxers learn that, some of them more than others and because of that they develop some tolerance, abosortion, resistance (skills) in that regards, but it is more important to learn how to avoid it or to learn how not to get hit flush in the first place.
Skills is basically what Philla said. It can be in any way style or form as long as it's effective. If a fighter didn't have any "skills" it would just be a bunch of club fighters slugging it on, unless that's what you want to see. But this is boxing so it's essential to have skills.