Which heavyweight was the most "Era dependent"?

Yes we've had this debate before and I didn't agree with you then either.

Beterbiev resume is not that strong at Light Heavyweight and he gets overrated in Heavyweight mythical match ups.

Beterbiev had a mighty struggle against the likes of Anthony Yarde who was recently made to look like a scrub vs Benavidez.

Beterbiev's best win without major controversy is Gvozdyk who made his name winning a single title fight against a 41 year old Stevenson.

I don't think Beterbiev beat Bivol and he got beat comprehensively in the rematch.

Stops Patterson without much trouble ? Pull the other one.

 

You want to talk about the one time Beterbiev got KD'd and not the 20 times Patterson did. OK.

 

Need I remind you Patterson beat heavy handed come forward fighters like Bonavena, Chuvalo.

Where is the stylistic comparison of lightning quick explosive punchers that compare to Patterson that Beterbiev beat ? I'll wait.

 

Patterson fought a lot like Bivol against guys who put him on the back foot.

 

Neither Bonavena nor certainly Chuvalo had the dynamic arsenal of Beterbiev. Neither had the twitch nor truly heavy hands he possessed in his prime.

Patterson was lightning quick when playing in contrast to zero-twitchers like Ingo and Chuvalo. Hell, even Terry Daniels lasted the route against him. Not saying Floyd wasn't a quality fighter for his era. I feel his gets short shrift in those discussions. But my money would be with Artur's well balanced, multi faceted power attack.

 

Bivol isn't a big puncher though he's had 1 stoppage in 6 years and that was against a late replacement.

Bivol is a better defensive fighter though I'll give you that.

 

I do feel like Beterbiev does get a bit overrated personally.

I'm not saying he's not a quality fighter and he would be a dangerous opponent for Patterson.

But he was labelled as this H2H monster and Bivol kind of burst that bubble and outside of the Bivol win which was highly controversial Beterbiev's resume is not overly strong.

I don't think Beterbiev has ever fought anyone in professional ranks atleast that combine Patterson's speed and explosive power.

 

I get it. Recency Bias is as strong as Nostalgia Bias.

I will say that no one "burst" that bubble (I had the first fight a draw) until Artur was 40.

Patterson indeed had fast hands, due in part to his short reach, but he was twitchy. It just wasn't enough often against elite competition.

 

I don't know if I'm understanding this correctly, but I think Rocky Marciano perfectly fit into his era and wouldn't have been considered so great in any other.

Considering he was a small, durable swarmer, the fact that his best opponents were not-so-tall technicians from the lower divisions—Charles, Walcott, and Moore—helped him immensely. I think Rock could have beaten Patterson, but someone like Max Baer or Max Schmelling from the previous era, or especially Sonny Liston from the next, would have been disastrous for him.

 

I was pointing out that it's a silly argument you were making. Just because Beterbiev got dropped once by a good left hook isn't proof he gets beaten by anyone under the sun with a decent left hook. Beterbiev has proven himself substantially more durable than Patterson and the argument about him being fragile based off him being dropped twice is a bad-faith argument and simply not a very fun one.

I would rather struggle with prime Yarde then get dropped by Rademacher, personally. Getting buzzed and dropped by a debutant during a sham title reign is embarrassing, and Patterson's reign is quite honestly a stain on boxing history. Also, Yarde is clearly a much diminished fighter compared to what he was when he fought Kovalev and Beterbiev, both fights which took a great deal out of him. To act like he was the same guy who fought Beterbiev against Benavidez after 5 years and a beating from Beterbiev later is disingenuous.

Beterbiev beat Bivol according to the 3 ringside judges, according to plenty of ringside scorers, and according to heaps of boxing fans who know how to score fights. And the rematch was a very close affair. Bivol's pitty-pat points count just as much as Beterbiev's ability to cut him off and chip away at him with those heavy hands. How you or I score those fights doesn't much matter, at the end of the day Beterbiev DID beat Bivol and there is a very clear argument which can made to defend the cards produced by judges, since plenty of knowledgeable scorers have substantiated those scores with their own, regardless of what you or I might think about it. Beating Bivol at 40 is also a better win than anything Patterson produced. Hell, Callum Smith is about as good as Johansson if not better. Let's not act like Patterson has a sterling resume or even an especially good reign.

Beterbiev is just as big as Patterson, hits just as hard if not harder, is considerably more durable, has a better resume, and is probably more skilled. It's hardly a stretch to think that he beats him.

 

It's not a silly argument at all what's silly is you said Beterbiev would beat Patterson easily when he's never registered a single win above Light Heavyweight and has been visibly rocked/hurt by Light Heavyweights.

Yes Beterbiev beat Bivol in a highly controversial decision that alot felt he didn't actually win.

The rematch was not close....Bivol comprehensively beat him in the region of 8-4.

Yes Beterbiev is as big as Patterson but Patterson has dealt with fighters of similar size as Beterbiev who were heavy handed come forward fighters.

Beterbiev has never fought anyone remotely close to Patterson in regards to blazing handspeed and explosive KO power.

 

You just don’t score power punches. The second fight was razor close. The verdict was decided by a single round on one card.

 

I don't score power punches landing on arms and gloves.

Bivol separated himself from Beterbiev in the 2nd half of the fight and won pretty clearly.

 

1 round on one card.

 

Outlanded Beterbiev in 9 out of the 12 rounds including 170-121 edge in power punches which is supposed to be Beterbiev's ball park.

Clear win for Bivol.