I just looked up Cleveland Williams' record and these are the KO's of guys who I think ever appeared in the Ring Magazine top 10-- Ernie Terrell, John Holman, Alex Miteff, Alonzo Johnson, Roger Rischer, Young Jack Johnson.
oh here we go. the last line of defence when there is no answer is come out and call somebody a troll. "I can't prove you wrong so you must be a troll" yes it's a bit like those spoiled kids who call everyone that won't agree with them a fascist nazi. It just means you can't back up anything. I do know the difference between harder and better. But we need to see the evidence don't we? Power is power. Let's say Frazier and Williams both have "top power" (There is no way on earth to test it since both guys are dead but anyway) how can one count as "just as equal" if he's not knocking out the same level of guys? And even this could be argued over if there was the footage to back up similar knockouts against just the lower level victims. no I think Williams had more power than Ali. Of course he did. And I think he was more explosive than Larry Holmes but Larry decked guys like weaver and David Bey who I could not count on Williams knocking over. Let's say Williams had the power was there but it could not be utilised. Frazier had the power there and it was utilised. And yet no explanation for the six times stopped Frankie Daniels giving Williams two hard ten round fights only to be knocked flat by Sonny Liston in 2 minutes in his next fight. Dosnt this say that #1 Liston hit harder than Williams, or #2 isn't Frankie exactly the low level kind of guy that Williams should have knocked out anyway? here you go again. Dead end. Come out using the troll card. Tut tut. Williams hit hard up to a level. shavers hit hard and he still knocked over better fighters than Williams. not knocking out a guy means it has nothing to do with one punch power between the pair. why has it got to do with hate? I don't hate anyone. I simply maintain Frazier hit harder than Williams. I don't hate poor Williams. Do I hate Ali because he didn't hit hard? Think about it. why would I want Primo to have elite power? Is this another crude attempt to portray me as some white supremacist when I'm defending Joe Frazier? I am the one who is mixed up? I have to have a mental illness to think Joe Frazier hits harder than a guy never to knock out a rated fighter? That makes me a troll? Why not agree to disagree? What is your problem? yes and a mug who hits harder but cannot realise his power in the ring effectively is not a puncher because nobody could ever know. Yes they can. They can be massive punchers "up to a level" I have no idea what this means but then You are the kind of stalker who sifts through thousands of posts of mine...[/QUOTE]
As blatantly explained it took me less than 2 minutes to accidentally stumble across your self defaming comments per Williams power. Your posts quite frankly aren't worth a pinch of **** and no-one would ever sift thru such worthless crud. As McVey says, you are an absolute nonsense.
Get back to me when you know what you are talking about. You are insulting me for choosing an impressive champion with an ATG accepted power of punch over an interesting character who had impressive power "only up to a level". Have a think about that son.
Unfortunately for you the ESB vote has Williams up by more than 2/3's of the vote. Telling ME to get back to YOU and calling Me "son" is yet another embarrassment. Shuffle along now little boy.
Yes of these guys I think Miteff was a very good win. I think that win got Williams his initial ranking.
nothing unfortunate For me. I have not insulted anyone for Agreeing with Ring Magazine that Frazier should be ahead of Williams on the hardest punchers of all time. Nor have I been searching through other people's posts for hours on end. Now that's unfortunate.
I have told you twice my search exposed you in 90 seconds flat. That's being generous. stumbled across tyour disgrace! Google - ("site:www.boxingforum24.com" cut it down to this site only) site:www.boxingforum24.com williams harder The very first link. Page 1 post 3 and there YOU are! Under 2 mins bud. P.S. The Ring named Frazier the "greater" puncher not the harder one. YOU are impossible.
You were burning the midnight oil pouring over pages and pages.. looking all ways... Then you found what I've been saying all along.
more phoney outrage. I agree with what I said two years ago. Williams had huge power up to a level. He hit hard. There is nothing wrong with selecting Joe Frazier as a harder puncher than Cleavland Williams. Nothing at all. Clearly you think it should not be allowed?
It's too late to go back on your own words now. You've been exposed as a phoney and dishonest poster and enough is enough. You have an obvious egenda against Williams which fits snugly into your agenda against Sonny Liston and you also look to take down George Foreman at every available opportunity.
The problem is people who disagree don't necessarily have to have an agenda. I don't think Williams hit harder than Frazier. I just don't. I do think Sonny Liston hit harder than Williams. I do think George Foreman is a great fighter but I think Frazier was past his best when they met. Nothing wrong in saying those three things. Everyone is entitled to their opinion. If I defend my opinion it's not because I hate anybody. I simply point out the reason behind my thinking. Sometimes that will include Reminding people of Baby Booze, Terry Sorrel type points. Sometimes It is necessary.
This is all good excepting when someone obnoxiously cherry picks and fixates to suit an obvious AGENDA. Now i have ZERO problem with anyone denying or criticising the likes of Williams providing they back it up with simple common sense. He's easily criticised as he lost almost all of his bigger bouts (aka Ruddock) and never pulled thru. When a fighter is favorable to you however you somehow make mountains out of the most mundane of opponents.
You are utterly mistaken. There is nothing deceitful about the information I have produced. I simply defend my point that Frazier is the harder puncher. It is not a crime to say so. If Ruddock did not knock out a rated fighter at least there is film of him knocking out fringe guys. Actual knockouts. We don't have this with Williams. If there was no film of Ruddock would it be right to put his power ahead of Joe Frazier? I don't think so. Nothing wrong with this. It is logical. and that my freind is you blown out of the water.