Why is Carlos Monzon ranked higher than Marvin Hagler?

Monzon jealous of Hagler? Head-scratching comment.

 

Yes, he was!

 

No, I was speaking of Hagler's many fans. Hagler was also great but Carlos proved his mettle as World Middleweight Champion from 1970 until his retirement as champion in 1977.

 

Great Post autumn 1976.

 

Actually I would say Monzon has a slightly better list of opponents overall that he beat compared to Hagler.

Hagler lost to an ATG Welterweight in SRL moving up to Middleweight.

Monzon on the other hand destroyed an ATG Welterweight moving up to Middleweight in Napoles.

Nino Benvenuti is a more highly rated Middleweight than anyone Hagler beat.

Emile Griffith achieved way more at Middleweight than any of Haglers title contenders.

Rodrigo Valdez is also better than any Middleweight Hagler ever beat.

Hearns and Duran are big names and are good wins for Hagler, but they didn't achieve anywhere near as much at Middleweight as fighters like Griffith, Valdez, Benvenuti.

 

Absolutely cracking post! Hard to argue with, really. Whenever the Monzon v Hagler topic is raised I immediately think of the way Carlos M bossed Nino B (a great fighter in his own right) at the start of his reign - and did the same thing to R Valdez (another great fighter!) at the end of it. Hagler was uncommonly talented, tough, and dedicated. So was Carlos M - and he was smarter than Hagler. Can you imagine him getting caught up in SRL's mind games?

 

A very good cracking post.

 

Thanks Richard.
Damn, though, I meant to type SRL not SRR!

 

No, Because to Carlos Monzon, boxing was a job. I never saw him get caught up with these Muhammad Ali wanna be type fighters. Monzon went into all of his fights with a very strong confidence that some great fighters have possessed, not overconfidence but confidence. Monzon spoke no English, so he could have possibly ignored Leonard sticking his tongue out and his bolo punch. Monzon would have stuck to business, not falling into Leonard's trap. Monzon and his lifelong trainer Amilcar Brusa would have outsmarted Dundee and Leonard, Dundee had a great respect for Monzon and Brusa. Dundee once called Monzon a complete fighter.

 

No problem buddy.

 

Exactly. Nailed it.

 

Tommy Hearns won Light Heavyweight Titles twice after losing to Hagler. Hearns is better than anyone Monzon beat. Which Monzon opponent could beat Virgil Hill and Dennis Andries at 175?

Answer: NONE of them could.

Jose Napoles isn't better than Ray Leonard. Neither is Griffith.

"Valdes is better than anyone Hagler ever beat?" The BEST guy Rodrigo Valdes beat was Bennie Briscoe. Everyone beat Bennie Briscoe. Valdes couldn't even beat Corro.

Alan Minter, Vito Antuofermo, Mustafa Hamsho weren't exactly punks at Middleweight. And they all had better wins than Rodrigo Valdes.

I've always preferred Hagler over Monzon.

 

I’d love to rank Hagler above Monzon and even if there is an argument that way, I just can’t quite do it, for two simple reasons:

1. They both reigned for the same amount of time but Monzon made two more successful defenses.
2. Monzon won his final career bout against his closest rival while Hagler lost his.

 

Monzon's closest rival's biggest wins were against Bennie Briscoe.

Hagler's closest rival's biggest wins were against Hagler, Hearns, Benitez, Duran and Lalonde.

If only Hagler could finish his reign against Rodrigo Valdes and Carlos Monzon could finish his against Ray Leonard.

I don't think Monzon gets to 14 defenses ... and Hagler does.

Would've been cool, either way.

Anyway, I always prefer watching Hagler's fights over Monzon's.

 

I'm not going to get in another long drawn out debate with you no offence, but I've stated why I think Monzon has a better record and all my points are valid and I'm sticking by it.

On a side note I actually prefer Hagler aswell and enjoy his style of fighting more, but i think Monzon has the better record overall.