Willie Pep deserved better...

Just to expand on some of the points that Stonehands raised about resume...

Here is a partial list of some of the contenders that Pep fought and defeated:

Chalky Wright (possible Top 20 featherweight)
Sal Bartolo (NBA titleholder in the 40's)
Phil Terranova (defeated Saddler, former NBA titleholder)
Jackie Wilson (former NBA titleholder)
Willie Joyce (top-flight lightweight contender, went 3-1 against Ike Williams)
Humberto Sierra (top 10 contender who had defeated Sandy Saddler)
Paddy DeMarco (two victories over Saddler, future lightweight champ)
Manuel Ortiz (atg bantamweight, legitimate threat at featherweight)


Now, throw in names like Eddie Compo, Teddy "Red Top" Davis, Johnny Famechon, Charlie Riley, Carlos Chavez, Armand Savoie...to say nothing of his series- fought at a farily advanced age, against Sandy Saddler, and you've actully got a pretty damned impressive resume.

Look at it this way...when Pep turned 30, he was 164-5-1. One of those losses was to a HOF fighter who relied on an infuriating style to win fights (Angott). Three were to Saddler, who, at minimum is a Top 3 lightweight and one of the Top 50 fighters of all time. The other loss (against Tommy Collins) ended via controversial stoppage, and was thought to have been thrown.

Pep was great...one of the very best in history. No questions asked.

 

If I stab you it will be fatal,Im not taking any ground I was joking ,Ive no idea what your alcohol consumption is and could care less,but in the unlikely event that you pm,d me with some personal info I would keep it to myself.Ive no interest in you or any other poster really ,we are just titles on a screen and thats fine,by me,Im interested in your opions on boxing and those of a few other posters thats as far as it goes,maybe you are a little sensitive after all?I wasnt trying to offend you,if I was Id have done a better job,rest assured I wont banter with you again.

 

Pep's record against Top 10 and Champion fighters according to the Ring at the time:

Wins:

Pedro Hernadez
Bobby 'Poison' Ivy
'Chalky' Wright (four times)
Allie Stolz
Sal Bartolo (three times)
Jackie Wilson (twice)
Willie Joyce
Manuel Ortiz
Lulu Constanitino
Joey Peralta
Cabey Lewis (twice)
Willie Roache
Phil Terranova
Jackie Graves
Jock Leslie
Miguel Acevedo
Paddy DeMarco
Sandy Saddler
Charley Riley
Ray Famechon

Losses:

Sammy Angott
Sandy Saddler (three times)
Tommy Collins
Lulu Perez (Proven fix, that meant Pep was never allowed to fight in New York again)
'Kid' Bassey
'Sonny' Leon

So I make that 27-8; with the last three defeats comming at the end of his career.

 

Its a pretty deep resume ,but not as deep as Charles or Moore,s imo ,Pep is a p4p fighter due to his superlative skills,top 10 Id say at least,higher than that is academic really.

 

Mcvey. When it comes to keeping on the straight and narrow (boxing), I don't mind Manassa. When he responds to my taunts, he should simply taunt back in return, instead of resorting to personal insults and going wide of the mark, aka drifting away from views on boxing. Yes, something I've became guilty of over the last couple of pages. Out of character for me.

If someone taunts me about being a "nuthugger", I'd come back with something similar. I have seen the vurnerability in him for quite a while now, and probably decided to play with it a bit.

One thing he knows he was wrong about, when he said I "insult on a daily basis". Overexaggeration from him to a high degree. And I was hardly insulting him, the word "taunting" would be better served.

 

He does resort to personal abuse rather quickly,Ive been guilty of it once or twice myself ,once with him and once with Mendoza/Dr Z.I shouldnt get too involved with a guy 40 years my junior,hes a good poster,one of the best ,but swearing at people isnt polite,constructive or mature,I think Ill keep my contact with him down to general boxing .I had my skirmish with Mendoza,whose also a good poster,at the end of the day its all really "much ado about nothing " isnt it?

 

Angott outboxed Pep, he didn't use infuriating style to win it. He counter-punched effectively in the first 5 rounds, making Pep miss most of the time, took a break the next 3 rounds, then won the remaining 2 rounds by doing some in-fighting and wrestling.

 

Actually your'e right ,its got no place here,my apologies.

 

Cant beleive some here are knocking pep,just seems so wrong to me,the guy was a boxing god,one of the all time greats,i really think people look into these things to much,you do that to long,and ****ing hell of course your find faults,thats pretty obvious in any one in any sport or any job.

 

Chavez.

 

yep...he was still top 10, though. Had Saddler in a world of trouble too when they fought.