Wladimir Klitschko vs Ali

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by Toney F*** U, Mar 29, 2021.

  1. Entaowed

    Entaowed Boxing Addict Full Member

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    To address the very delimited thing I wrote that you chose to address...
    It is possible that this is correct. But it seems unlikely.
    Why? First, he slowly gained weight during his first reign, staying very lean, & in every other fight around then was lighter-he was just under 215 even near his exile against Chuvalo.

    Second, if you check other sources, the heaviest you can find for Ali is 210.
    Lastly, there are numbers in that document that hint that this was likely an estimate, not measured, or used for promotional purposes.

    Which is: look at his reach (really that is mistaken, it is wingspan) as 82".
    There is NO other reliable source where you can find it listed as anything other than 78"-80".
    His wrist is listed as 9" there!
    That is absolutely massive. Also bigger than Liston who had a larger frame.
    Unless someone is obese-& Ali was very lean-You would have to have a huge skeleton to have your wrist-measured accurately, tape measure pulled not tight but taut...And done properly at the narrowest place-be a full 9".

    You will normally see such a real measurement with someone who is very-extremely tall.
    I could not find one for Primo Carnera offhand, but given his growth disorder & overall size he may have had 9" wrists.
    Ali was listed against Holmes as 7 3/4"-that is likely correct.
    The difference of an inch & change may not seem like much...But you need to consider the discrepency in percentage.
    It is the equivalent of being over a foot taller than another man.

    If they can screw up wingspan & wrist measurements like that, they likely never even TOOK the measurements.
    Or inaccurately, such as doing it a bit up the forearm.

    Tale of the tapes are often INFAMOUSLY wrong.

    Below is a more realistic accounting of his proportions vs. Holmes.
    OH & the second one I found an even more BS wingspan measurement...Ali vs. Holmes.
    Ali's chest may have been exaggerated here-though a bit bigger because of bodyfat...
    But he certainly never had the 82" your source lists, fuhgettibout the 84" wingspan claimed below, lol!

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    This content is protected
     
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2021
  2. Surrix

    Surrix Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Well, I do not judge boxer A or boxer B.
    I need reputable sources about athletes size and for me there looks that it is protocol's picture or legit copy.

    Will see, I did not had researched about Ali specially.

    Needs to check of course. For me it is like uni work more than about any person and aimed to see a lot of athletes from 1945 till maybe 2020.

    Will try to find out of course.

    I already had made some 37 pages for book but cos I prefer to use Uni like criteria this after research and correcting had been reduced to 10 pages and later because lesser words is better this had been reduced to just approx 7 pages for book.
     
  3. Surrix

    Surrix Well-Known Member Full Member

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    I did not had get till 1959th for book so All is not in these 7 pages.
    I really need legit reference sources.
     
  4. Entaowed

    Entaowed Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Thanks, but I do not know what "Uni" work is.

    My point was that IF those measurements were so off on Ali's wrist-& overstated his wingspan-like the other listing when it says Ali has an absurd 84" wingspan...
    The weight given for Ali is suspect.
    Check other sources.
    I think that sometimes places just make estimates,. Maybe take what the boxer says, when fully dressed...
    Or even Ali who seemed always lean those days was a bit heavier between fights.
     
  5. mark ant

    mark ant Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Cooper said of Ali: "He was fast. The two fighters who had the fastest hands were him and Patterson--I still think Patterson had slightly faster hands than Ali did. Ali didn`t punch as hard. Patterson had more one punch power than Ali did, with his left hook. The big thing with Ali was that he was 6`3.5. His measurements across here (his reach) was something like 90 inches. So he knew when he was that much out of reach of an opponent. He was unorthodox. He was so tall and so fast and had such great reflexes. He was the original. And got away with it. All that Ali shuffling. No heavyweightin the past could move as fast as he did on his feet--or is ever likely to in the future. He was the best moving heavyweight of all time. That`s why I couldn`t stand off him. I knew the way to beat him was basically to pressure him all the time."
     
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  6. Surrix

    Surrix Well-Known Member Full Member

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    I had meaning that to use facts there should be used at least 2 cross checkable legit sources if this is possible.
    More legit sources about 1 fact = better. Lesser = worse.

    With boxer's reach I really had more problems than with weight.
    Since boxing orgs always had used weight in limits and mandatory weight ins, they had fixed weight.
    Reach never had been limited in any kind and I think supervisors didn't had enough attention to reach measurements at all.

    With basketball players for me was opposite thing: to get their height was easier, weight not easy.
    Since their height had been widely discussed, posted in notable media etc. Their weight no one limits and looks they does not have weight ins. No one cared about their weight if they performed as team had expected and predicted.
     
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  7. Entaowed

    Entaowed Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Cooper maybe added a 1/2" to Ali's height, but he was waaaaaaay off with (what really is) wingspan.
    Ali is credibly listed as 78"-80". I source Sussix had listed him at 84". Whether or not Liston had this wingspan, Ali did not.
    If Ali had 90", le would literally have the largest "Ape Factor" of all time (differential between wingspan & reach).

    He may be correct about the rest. Although I unno if Ali tried to his Cooper with his max one punch power, like Patterson would with his "Gazelle Punch".
     
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  8. Surrix

    Surrix Well-Known Member Full Member

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    I didn't had listed just use available sources. Ali reach had been listed in different numbers, yeah. Not only Ali, with boxer's reach this does happens frequently.
     
  9. Toney F*** U

    Toney F*** U Boxing junkie Full Member

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    Ali wouldn’t have that height and reach advantage against Wlad
     
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  10. Entaowed

    Entaowed Boxing Addict Full Member

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    I know different things are listed, I am saying nothing but somewhere between a 78-80" wingspan is credible.
     
  11. mark ant

    mark ant Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Good point about the height but Liston had a reach of 84 inches, longer than Wlad`s.
     
  12. Surrix

    Surrix Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Liston was slow if compare with prime Wlad and Wlad definitely will not use hands down position when he will allow to close distance with good guy. Also Wlad was very athletic and was skilled in clinch game + with ex soviet ammy and western training background.
    He will had destroyed Liston if they had fought vs Prime Wlad.

    For Wlad more problems might had been created 220 lbs imaginable Patterson's version not 220 lbs Liston.
    Liston I think most likely had lost vs Patterson if he had his weight and size.
     
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  13. Surrix

    Surrix Well-Known Member Full Member

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    If about boxers, I had recently about one boxer ( not mentioned here in thread ) cross checked weight ins weight from official sources, about his reach there are listed 3 variants by promoter, boxrec and him. Boxer had competed till 2015 and this was what it was.
     
  14. mark ant

    mark ant Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Liston had a fast jab and a really quick hook.
     
  15. ironchamp

    ironchamp Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Ali would have beaten him inside the distance.