Wladimir Klitschko vs Sonny Liston

If any of Wlad's opponents had the ability to expose a flat-footed fighter then it was Haye. He didn't, and in fact ended up falling over himself since he was forced to lunge with his shots. Why? Because almost every time he tried to move into range he found that Wlad had moved out again.

Watch that fight again and note how Wlad constantly keeps Haye at the end of his jab. You can't do that without good footwork.

 

One question, SP_Mauler: do you think that Wlad and Helenius are similar fighters? In what way would you say they differ?

 

Haye was scared to engage. Haye goes backwards then runs. The fact remains Wladimir despite being as awesome as you made him out to be looked to almost fall over in RD2/RD3. Sonny doesn't move back he moves side to side then engages if you miss.

 

Don't know only seen the first 5 rounds vs Del Boy. When the time comes ill watch him.

 

Haye never ran in that fight (if by running you mean skipping around the ring Dirrell style way out of punching range). What he did do was employ a mixture of slip and baiting off the back foot coupled with quick ambush punches whenever he saw an opening. It's not the most manly way of fighting, but it kept him in the firing zone at almost all times, and probably ended up giving him more opportunities than blind aggression alone would have done.

I see a lot of this "scared to engage" stuff with Wlad, but how many of his opponents were truly scared of fighting him? Where's his King Levinsky or Michael Spinks moment?

What I saw in the Haye fight was Haye wary of committing himself too much, due to his past stamina problems as well as, yes, Wladimir's power, but that's not the same as saying he was scared to engage. If he was, then that nervous energy would have affected his entire game and he most likely would have got stopped on exhaustion alone. Haye willingly kept himself in Wlad's punching zone in order to capitalise on openings, relying on his fast reflexes and upper body movement to take the sting off the worst of Wlad's offence.

Wlad, for his part, moved very effectively side to side, as well as back and forward. Had he simply moved back, a fighter of Haye's experience level would have jumped on that and tried to force him back to the ropes with a sustained barrage, as he did against a number of his other opponents. A brief stumble in a twelve round fight is hardly indicative of terrible footwork, especially against an opponent as quick as Haye.

 

Wlad has been koed brutally several times by nobodies. Liston was one of boxings all time punchers. When Sonny lands cleanly and he will the walking statue with the China chin will be once again brutally knocked out. Ross Purity the bum of bums knocked Wlad out for Christ sake!

 

Your astute contributions to this forum continue to be invaluable.

 

I must say that Wlad is a beast, and I am a fan.
I did hope for Haye to pull of the upset though.
Liston is a killer, Wlad has never faced a fighter
as tough as Liston. Both have great jabs so it would be
Competitive from the outside. Liston can eat Wlad,s right
hands. Wlad has great power evident from one punch KOs,
Manny Steward, fighters, sparring pargners etc. But fighters
have taken a lot of his shots Brewster, Wach, Peter. Liston's
punch repertoire would be key, especially the left hook. Liston
has the jab, and the power and punch variety to hurt and stop
Wlad.

 

well I disagree with every word but fair enough

 

Would he need to? He moves well enough to dodge most punches from shorter men (who are typically still taller than Liston), and he combines that with being a big man who can crack with both hands.

A 6'3", 210 pound Ali made Liston look small, staggered him, puffed up his face, and made him quit after only a handful of rounds. I can't imagine Liston walking through far greater fire against a much bigger boxer-puncher to score a KO.

Liston was coming off the two biggest and best wins of his career, back-to-back. Conversely Ali was struggling and looking vulnerable against the likes of Doug Jones and Cooper. There's a reason Liston was such a huge favorite to win. Ali was the one who wasn't in his prime (yet).

If Liston couldn't be relied on to fight with his heart and soul under these circumstances, with his title on the line, when could he?

Besides, Liston had his chance to prove he could do better in the rematch, and instead he folded from a phantom punch.

 

This is basically the way I see it.

 

And Liston has been beaten by LHWs/CWs. :nono

 

Floyd Patterson skill wise one of the greatest. Far far farrr exceeds anything Wladimir has faced

 

Haye was able to land to due his quick feet something which Sonny has and he also has power and a longer reach.

Haye tried to land one on Wlad chin all night. His mistake but at the same time Wlad hardly landed,well "hardly" what we're use to seeing when he faces "top" contenders like Pianeta&Mormek. Wlad can't handle speed combine that with power,long reach and a mentality to brawl, Wlad has too much to over come. You see Haye ducked when he came in,something which Sonny does,and landed quite easily.

I agree Wlad did cut off Haye very nice but Sonny doesn't take a backwards step, If Wlad comes forward he's going to eat and take punches something he's never felt before and mentally Sonny has him covered.

 

Yea yea the KO ratio thing lmao..decent opponent = high ko ratio ahahhaha